Heather Middleton on Nashville Tourism
Heather Middleton is the Chief Marketing Officer for Visit Music City. Throughout the conversation, Heather shares insights into Nashville's booming tourism industry, touching upon the economic impact of visitors, including astonishing stats like the $29 million spent daily in Nashville.
About Heather Middleton
Heather Middleton serves as the Chief Marketing Officer for the Nashville Convention & Visitors Corp (Visit Music City), where she has dedicated over 20 years of service. Starting her tenure in 2004 as Vice President of Public Relations, she now leads the marketing, public relations, and major event production efforts that drive Nashville’s tourism initiatives. With her leadership, Heather has been instrumental in shaping Nashville’s brand identity and securing high-profile events, positioning the city as a top global destination.
Heather sheds light on the roles and strategies behind marketing the city not just to national tourists but also international visitors. She reflects on significant events like the 2010 flood, the impact of sports teams, and the unique cultural facets that make Nashville a vibrant destination. Heather also addresses common misconceptions about downtown Nashville, emphasizing the importance of exploring diverse neighborhoods.
As Nashville is an evolving brand, Heather has been part of a multi-million dollar initiative that expanded Music City’s identity beyond its country music roots to a globally recognized destination. She continues to focus on fostering neighborhood tourism, promoting a more authentic, local experience, and helping the city’s tourism sector thrive as downtown Nashville sees unprecedented growth through public-private investments totaling $24.6 billion.
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[00:00:00] Spencer: Welcome to Signature Required. It is intended for Tennesseans, by Tennesseans.
[00:00:06] Carli: What makes them tick? What lights their fire? We're
[00:00:09] Spencer: pulling forward people that, unless you listen to this interview, you might not know a thing about them. The heart of a Tennessean, the volunteer state, is serve. Do so largely without self promotion.
[00:00:24] Carli: And these are genuine people that get up every day and want to make art, or want to educate the nations, or want to have a heart of love in a way that makes a difference.
[00:00:35] Spencer: Learn from 50 years of experience, take a nugget away, and then go share it with a friend.
[00:00:45] Spencer: Heather Middleton. Welcome to Signature Required.
[00:00:47] Heather: Thank you.
[00:00:48] Spencer: You are the Chief Marketing Officer for Visit Music City, which kind of makes you one of the most important people in the world to all manner of people coming to Nashville. [00:01:00] Maybe top amongst them are bachelorette parties. Is that true?
[00:01:02] Carli: I don't know if that's true or not.
[00:01:04] Carli: I'm not sure it's most important. No.
[00:01:07] Spencer: Some of the stats are unbelievable that visitors to Nashville spend twenty nine million dollars a day in Nashville. Correct. Which is crazy, and I think my first question to you is, how much of that twenty nine million dollars is cowboy boots? I don't
[00:01:25] Heather: have an answer for that.
[00:01:26] Heather: Do have a pie chart on how much of it is, like, western apparel?
[00:01:29] Spencer: Okay.
[00:01:30] Heather: That I don't know. That's a recent trend, also. Um, you know. Uh, fashion music. It's all very cyclical. So, um, I'm sure the cowboy boot sales have gone up in the last few years. How many shots
[00:01:43] Spencer: of tequila can you get for 29 million in downtown Nashville?
[00:01:47] Spencer: Yeah. Well,
[00:01:47] Heather: you have to remember it's not just downtown Nashville. We are. Um, you know, marketing and doing PR for the entire county. So we talk about Nashville a lot by us as being a city of neighborhoods. [00:02:00] So whether that is the neighborhood of, you know, East Nashville or Wedgwood Houston, which is sort of an up and coming neighborhood or, um, Bellevue, you know, there are a lot of, um, in the Fordyce Center out there that the Preds were a part of building.
[00:02:16] Heather: You know, there are a lot of tournaments that go on out there, which is also a part of tourism. So, um, we really are tourism for the entire county, not just downtown. I think that's a big misnomer about what we do.
[00:02:27] Spencer: See, I think that's straight away learning, cause I, I think there's so much tension as it relates to downtown Nashville and how it's changed.
[00:02:38] Spencer: I mean, I'm born and raised here. Yeah, that's awesome. I've spent my whole life here. And There's an aspect of it where you love it for your city. I mean, the downtown Nashville that I grew up with was not a place you'd ever go. I mean, you did not go downtown Nashville and it looks so different. But I think you bring up a really, really good point in that It's a much broader thing.
[00:02:58] Spencer: It's a much broader thing.
[00:02:59] Heather: I also am always curious with locals. Sometimes when they say downtown, they really only mean about five blocks of honky tonks because people will say, I don't go downtown and I go, well, do you go to a Preds game? Or do you go to the Ryman or do you go to T PAC or do you go to the symphony hall?
[00:03:16] Heather: Well, you are experiencing downtown. Um, and so I think sometimes that gets a little skewed, um, locally.
[00:03:26] Spencer: All right. So fun aside. So your role as marketing officer, your, your marketing for, for, uh, visit music city, what is visit music city? Uh, how did it start? And just walk us through a little bit of your job.
[00:03:40] Heather: So, uh, we are really the sales and marketing arm for the city in terms of tourism. So we are selling the city both to conventions, to, um, groups, you know, group travel, um, travel agents, AAA offices, and then also leisure travelers. So family, friends, you know, [00:04:00] girlfriends, whatever, guys weekends, um, we really are involved in all of that.
[00:04:05] Heather: So we have. On the sales side, a sales team that is selling to conventions, which book? People don't really realize how far out some of those conventions book and then Also on the sales side are the travel agents and the group travel and then marketing We certainly on the marketing side support that sales team and their marketing efforts to those audiences But we're also marketing to the leisure traveler Um, you know, go or so that's all.
[00:04:31] Heather: And that's all over the world. We, um, we market internationally. We market in Canada, U. S. So it's a broad, a broad scope in terms of what we do.
[00:04:41] Carli: I'm curious what percentage part, if you had to guess, you may not have that data on hand. Is international travel to
[00:04:48] Heather: Nashville? It's probably, it's growing because we have some new flights coming, so it's going to grow.
[00:04:54] Heather: It's probably somewhere between 7 and 10 percent. It's hard to tell because, [00:05:00] as we say often, There's not a turnstile, necessarily. We know how many people are coming in, um, on the planes. Obviously, if there's a direct flight, we can count those numbers and know that they're coming here. But if someone flies into New Orleans and they drive to Nashville, it's not quite as easy to count.
[00:05:18] Heather: Um, you know, we have some cell phone data and things like that, but there's not a perfect turnstile. Perfect number. But it will grow with two new direct flights, uh, to Europe.
[00:05:27] Spencer: Help me understand Visit Music City. What is that? Is, is that, uh, it's a non profit, right? Right. 501C6. So was that created by someone and then it got kind of taken under the wing of Nashville?
[00:05:42] Spencer: They're like, hey, this So we started
[00:05:44] Heather: as a part of the chamber.
[00:05:45] Spencer: Okay.
[00:05:45] Heather: And in, uh, 2004, we came out from underneath the chamber and have our own board of directors, uh, we have a contract with the city, so we contract with the city to market and sell the city as a tourism destination, and, [00:06:00] um, we have a, a tourism commission that keeps tabs on us for, for the city, and, um, but we are our own private entity.
[00:06:07] Heather: With our own board of directors as well.
[00:06:09] Carli: And I don't have a lot of familiarity. I know what a 501c3 is, but you're a 501c6, correct? So how does that work economically? Because are people donating to visit Music City? How does that work? So
[00:06:23] Heather: we are funded primarily by the hotel tax collections. Vast majority of our funding is hotel tax collections.
[00:06:28] Heather: So the hotel sales tax, a portion of that goes to the city. Um, and the state, and then a portion of that comes back to us, uh, like, I think it's 2%, comes back to us, um, to market the city. We also raise some private dollars, we're a membership based organization, um, you know, our big events, New Year's Eve, Fourth of July that we do for the city, we have, we sell sponsorships for that, so there are some private dollars also.
[00:06:54] Heather: Um, that, that we raise on our own, but primarily we're funded by the hotel tax collection.
[00:06:59] Carli: So you're in [00:07:00] charge of those wicked cool fireworks.
[00:07:02] Heather: We are. Every summer. Not me personally, but yes, our office certainly. Uh, 4th of July is a big event for us last year. Most years we have over 300, 000 people downtown.
[00:07:13] Heather: It's a lot of fun. It's a free event. It's a great It's a great way for us to not only bring in visitors, but give back to the city and to the locals. Um, and the same with New Year's Eve. It's a free event for our city. That is a, you know, world class event. We had about 220, 000 people at New Year's Eve this year.
[00:07:28] Heather: And, um, We're Music City, it's on brand, um, we're so fortunate to have those artists who want to play our events, and, um, it's a hometown show for them, which is, you know, really cool. And, um, visitors and locals love it. We're glad to do it.
[00:07:44] Spencer: I like at the top where you quickly corrected the misconception that we're talking about more than Broadway.
[00:07:51] Spencer: Yes. And so, in your capacity, as you're sitting around people that are not from Broadway, but [00:08:00] from the outskirts of Nashville, what are those conversations like? Because I would imagine they're really competing for that interest to say, hey, we want people to know that we've got these amazing, you know, the Preds Arena.
[00:08:13] Spencer: We have these activities and tourism pieces. What are those conversations like? That, are they trying to say, Hey, let us convince you that this should be part of a marketing push that you make. How do those interactions go?
[00:08:32] Heather: Well, I think, you know, downtown, um, Gaylord area as well, because of the convention centers that are in both of those locations, they just are going to automatically get a certain number of people, right?
[00:08:46] Heather: That's just location. It's just all location. But certainly we always look for. Unique things aren't our website is set up by neighborhood Um when we bring we bring journalists from all over the world in every year [00:09:00] hundreds of journalists come to visit nashville Um to write about the city from a tourism perspective And we set up their itineraries by neighborhood.
[00:09:08] Heather: So we're always trying to you know, it might be west nashville where they go to Uh cheekwood, but they also might go to a restaurant Out on that side of town. So we really do try to spread the love and um, make sure everybody You know is is highlighted in some form or fashion. We always say we our job is to bring people to town And showcase all that they have to offer the individuals get to pick and choose what they do, right?
[00:09:37] Heather: We have no control over saying you need to go to this person this place or this restaurant or this attraction Um, it's our job to explain what all nashville has to offer
[00:09:47] Carli: So I moved to Nashville in 2004, which is right around the time that I think you joined Views of McCity. Correct. Correct. Okay, so you've been there around then.
[00:09:58] Carli: And seeing some of these [00:10:00] neighborhoods, just since we were in college, which was, you know, at Vandy, like 12 South. Has absolutely exploded the food scene in east nashville We would just drive over there from fanny to try to go to rose pepper and get some fajitas And now there is so much great by the way And they have the best signage.
[00:10:18] Carli: They're so cheeky. It's the I love it a little plug for them but What are you seeing in terms of you have such insight to the data? What neighborhoods are you seeing really explode in your tenure and which ones are you really hoping people will start to notice?
[00:10:30] Heather: Yeah, we do have data that shows us where visitors Visitors And it's certainly East Nashville, 12th South, Germantown, the Gulch, are the top four on the list, I would say, but they all end up on there in some form or fashion, um, at different times, you know, I think there's, um, the Nations, Sylvan Park, you know, the, where you find restaurants or attractions are where, you Where you usually see the, the visitors going.
[00:10:59] Carli: [00:11:00] What's the best kept secret? Like what do you not want to say is amazing because it's your place and you don't want everyone to find it. I
[00:11:07] Heather: don't, oh no, I don't keep secrets like that. You know why? Because these small businesses, they need support and they, You know, neither. So I don't keep any secrets.
[00:11:16] Heather: Maybe I should. I don't know. I love, uh, but they, they need the traffic. So,
[00:11:21] Spencer: yeah, people in marketing, they're really poor. Really? The worst.
[00:11:27] Carli: What do you think people are missing? Like, what are some spots that you think are the next cusp of taking off?
[00:11:33] Heather: Um, I, you know, I do think some of it is The neighborhoods, um, they're, I think sometimes visitors don't realize how easy it is to get to some of those neighborhoods, you know, East Nashville is right there.
[00:11:47] Heather: Yep. Um, Wedgwood Houston is right there. Um, so I think they don't maybe have a perspective on how close it all really is. Wedgewood, Houston is certainly a neighborhood that we've been watching for a while in [00:12:00] terms of what it's offering. It's just, it just keeps adding more and more offerings for visitors.
[00:12:05] Heather: They want local, they want, um, to shop local, they want to take home something that they can't find where they come from, right? They won't experience Uh, uh, dining scene that is, is different in some form or fashion, whether that's a meat and three or hot chicken or a chef driven restaurant that is only in Nashville.
[00:12:24] Heather: So we're always looking at where those pockets of, of, you know, unique local businesses are located for sure. Fair enough.
[00:12:33] Spencer: And if I'm a. Okay. Small business or I believe that I have something. How do I get on your radar? Like, how do you we get a lot of press releases? Okay. Yeah. Yeah,
[00:12:44] Heather: we do And and you know that's changed over the years in terms of The amount of information where we see, I mean, Nashville's booming.
[00:12:52] Heather: There are more restaurants opening now than ever before. And it's, it's sometimes hard to keep up with. So we appreciate when people notify us and say, we've, [00:13:00] you know, we have this new restaurant these days, restaurants are hiring PR. Teams they didn't used to do that back in 2004 when I started That's a new thing for sure in the last five to ten years um, but we are a membership based organization, um, which Is comes with its own package of benefits, um at different levels and that kind of thing.
[00:13:23] Heather: We try to meet people where they are Um and meet small businesses in particular where they are but um Yeah, it's just outreach quite frankly. We're always You Looking for what's new. We need to know so we we welcome people telling us, you know, we've got a new restaurant We've got a new shop. We have a new Experience, you know experiences are what so many travelers want these days So we're we always welcome that information
[00:13:49] Carli: my favorite experience that I don't think people know exists is the goo goo.
[00:13:53] Carli: It's not fun experience where you Isn't it fun? I'm just like a diehard Goo Goo Cluster fan anyway, but we took our [00:14:00] kids and you can customize and they're, you know, trying to get them to not lick the chocolate, right? And I just was so proud of our city to have such a cool experience that was It's really cool.
[00:14:11] Carli: So Nashville, but also different than what you might think
[00:14:14] Heather: Yeah. You could do. It's really fun. And um, Beth Seishon over there who does all of the marketing and she has done an And she's been at it for a long time and really, um, has elevated the experience when it comes to Google clusters. It is so Nashville, and it's so unique.
[00:14:33] Heather: And it is a fun experience for any age, right? Kids, it doesn't matter. And they, They've done a great job. They really have. That's a good one. So
[00:14:41] Carli: did you always see yourself working in tourism? Let's say, were you a blogger in the day or are you just a foodie that really wanted like the in on all the restaurants?
[00:14:50] Carli: No, I wasn't any of those things. The best hot chicken? I wasn't any of those things. Like, give me all the hot chicken. I will run this nonprofit for hot chicken.
[00:14:56] Heather: No, I, uh, I actually started out, I was a film and [00:15:00] television major and I started out in New York and went to worked in television there and moved to Nashville and worked in the music industry.
[00:15:10] Heather: And just so happened my job right after the music industry, I was really hired to work with sports clients, but they happened to have this little entity called the Nashville CVB, which was under the chamber at the time. And I got roped into some projects, really some PR projects. And The next thing I knew it was, Oh, could Heather work on this project?
[00:15:35] Heather: Could Heather work on that project? And they eventually hired me away. I honestly didn't even understand that it was an industry. It was a job really. I mean, in the back of my head, I guess I knew that, but I would not have thought of it as a career does that. Yes. I didn't understand that it was a career.
[00:15:52] Heather: So, um, I sort of fell into it. I got really lucky, honestly. And it's, and I feel so fortunate because. It [00:16:00] took all of the things I've done in my past and really wrapped it up into one job. You know, I worked in the music industry in Nashville at a label and so I still get to do some of those things. You know, television is still a piece of what I get to work on in terms of like, for example, um, you know, the BBC is coming over here, um, in a month or two to do a a new, um, program on.
[00:16:23] Heather: I'm a big fan of country music and on Nashville and the Opry's 100 then. So I still, and sports, I worked in sports for a little while, so I still get to dabble in all of that. But you know, it, I'm so glad that I had the opportunity to be exposed to it as an industry because it is a lot of fun. We love it.
[00:16:41] Heather: You know, we give people memories. That's really the bottom line. We sell memories and fun and we hope that people come in and takes home and go, gosh, remember Nashville. That was such a great time.
[00:16:55] Spencer: I'd love to spend maybe 10 minutes on sports because I [00:17:00] really think getting your insight On a couple of different pieces would, would be really fun.
[00:17:06] Spencer: Like you can take these in any order of things that stand out, but like, I'd, I'd love to hear a little bit about Nissan stadium and the 4 billion project that, that, that is, I'd, I'd love to hear, you know, developments like getting the NFL draft here, the all star game, the relocation of the sounds and how amazing that facility is, um, The Preds.
[00:17:31] Spencer: I just, if you could just talk broadly about sports and just give us your 90 second view, because you've been in the seat of seeing a change for a really long time. I just would really be so fascinated to hear your thoughts. So take some of those and just give us a highlight.
[00:17:47] Heather: Sports has changed our city.
[00:17:48] Heather: Yeah, there's no denying it. I mean, you know, I moved here in 1997. So the arena had just been built. Yeah. I moved here the day they announced Nashville would get a [00:18:00] hockey team. An expansion
[00:18:00] Spencer: team. And when you say the arena, for people that don't know, you're talking Bridgestone arena.
[00:18:05] Spencer: Yeah.
[00:18:05] Heather: So, I'm a huge hockey fan, and so, I was thrilled that they announced that we were getting a hockey team, but it has changed everything.
[00:18:13] Heather: I mean, the arena being built downtown changed slowly all of downtown. That was a reason to go downtown. As you said earlier, people didn't have a reason to go, right? I don't even
[00:18:23] Spencer: remember what was there before the arena. Do you?
[00:18:25] Heather: No, because I didn't live here. I mean, that was before my
[00:18:30] Carli: time, it's always been there and the concert venue that it is and
[00:18:34] Heather: all of those things.
[00:18:35] Heather: And then, you know, the Titans happening at the same time, um, coming, you know, building that stadium and the Titans coming to town. Uh, those are the kinds of things that spur an economy. Those are the kinds of things that Not only add quality of life for vi for locals, but reasons for visitors to come as well.
[00:18:54] Heather: And um, yeah, it's changed everything for sure.
[00:18:57] Spencer: What was it like when you heard that the draft [00:19:00] was coming? Oh my gosh, we were so happy we worked on that
[00:19:02] Heather: for a long time. Tell me some of that. So we were part of the, the bid, uh, to, to bring the draft to Nashville and, uh. It was, I don't think we were at the top of their list initially, but it was fun to sell it on a, sell them on Nashville and, you know, see their minds change and really grasp the vision of what it could be.
[00:19:24] Heather: Mm-hmm. And I think we changed the NFL draft. The city changed how the NFLI agree with, with the draft. I agree
[00:19:29] Spencer: with that. Totally agree. And
[00:19:30] Heather: um, and it was a lot of fun. It was a lot of, they were ama, you know, the NFL, they were so good to work with and. Um, you know, they let us do it the Nashville way and it really worked.
[00:19:44] Heather: It really worked.
[00:19:45] Spencer: What are some of the knocks that maybe you don't have to speak specifically to the NFL, but just in general, like if you're going to talk about why Nashville normally, this is not what you do. You talk about why it's good, but the things that you have to counteract, what are the things where [00:20:00] the NFL might not have us on the top three where they say, you know, Nashville doesn't have enough.
[00:20:05] Spencer: hotel capacity or Nashville's public transit isn't where it should be. I'm just making things up. What are some of the knocks on Nashville that you have to change minds?
[00:20:14] Heather: Well, I think, um, if you were to ask the NFL previously about a Super Bowl here, obviously Dome Stadium was a must, but also hotel.
[00:20:25] Heather: Capacity and not just capacity, the high level hotels. We needed luxury hotels and we did not have those until just a few years ago, but that's not rooms for a Superbowl. Um, so we needed more luxury properties to come in, um, for some of those larger events, they expect the four seasons and, you know, um, the one hotel and, and that level of service.
[00:20:51] Heather: And so. We're there now, but we were not there when we hosted the draft, for example, in terms of what they look like. [00:21:00] So will we get a
[00:21:01] Carli: Super Bowl?
[00:21:03] Heather: I think we have a good shot. I mean, I think we have a good shot. We have to, you know, the stadium is obviously a big piece of that. But now that we have the hotel package in place, it is so walkable.
[00:21:15] Heather: Um, I think the NFL knows we can pull off. a really unique, very Nashville event. And, um, we're going to go for it for sure. Oh, we're going to go for it.
[00:21:27] Spencer: Talk to us about some of your evolution of seeing how the riverfront scene has changed over time. Cause that's another, I mean, We had the flood in 2010, which just absolutely reshaped the face of that lower Broadway.
[00:21:44] Spencer: And I know we're focused on Broadway, and you do more than this, but I just am interested to see Broadway's really
[00:21:48] Heather: important to what we do.
[00:21:49] Spencer: Yeah. So walk me through some of that flood and what your headspace was during that season and just how you've seen Nashville go through.
[00:21:59] Heather: The [00:22:00] flood was interesting.
[00:22:01] Heather: I don't think I understood at the time the public perception of when a flood happens. People were cancelling things months and months out, thinking there would still be water, or there would be, and there was confusion about, What was damaged and what wasn't damaged and so But the flood was interestingly a turning point for nashville.
[00:22:23] Heather: I think it was a time when the city really came together and said We've got this, we're going to come back better than ever, you know, and everybody sort of pulled together. You remember the whole Nate neighbor, helping neighbor. And, um, and that is truly when tourism's trajectory started.
[00:22:43] Heather (4): Really? Yes. Back to go back
[00:22:44] Heather: to 2010.
[00:22:45] Heather: Yes. And look at the numbers and just how the growth pattern happened, um, starting at that time. But I think the music industry pulled together. Um, we had, um, I lived in an area that was flooded and [00:23:00] couldn't get out of my neighborhood and didn't have electricity. I remember plugging my phone into my car for battery and writing spots, um, that at the time Great American Country was and, um, Scripps was going to air for us for free.
[00:23:19] Heather: Um, and artists were doing it for free saying, come visit Nashville. We did that literally every day. 24 hours into the flood. We were writing scripts saying Nashville's open for business and I think That was a moment when the business community and the music community and the sports community really came together to to unite to you know Bring that Nashville back and I think it made a difference.
[00:23:41] Heather: I really do
[00:23:42] Carli: It's really powerful and then Laura Broadway is not done that Riverfront. You guys have some big plans. Yes
[00:23:47] Heather: We, yes, we hope, you know, the riverfront is much more activated. It will happen with the new stadium on the other side of the river. There will be a whole new neighborhood over there, um, and so, [00:24:00] you know, Nashville's growth is not, certainly not slowing.
[00:24:03] Heather: Um, we hope it's thoughtful and, um, inclusive, but it's, we say this all the time and you, I think it's so true. Cities don't stand still. They grow or they die. And you certainly don't want to be a dying city because it's really, really, really hard to come back from. So there's no such thing as a city that just stays at a certain point in time.
[00:24:27] Heather: So we, you know, while I think there are times maybe we could be more thoughtful in growth, it is, we are very fortunate to have a city that's been growing. Very fortunate.
[00:24:39] Spencer: And, you know, one other heavy topic, but I'm just really fascinated because you're I'm sitting on the front lines of it. So, walk us through Christmas morning and the bombing.
[00:24:48] Spencer: Yes. And it was 2020. It was. December 25th, 2020. Where were you? What, what, what did that mean to you? What was the implication of it?
[00:24:57] Heather: I was home and [00:25:00] up early with kids. And so, um, you know, I, I saw the news alerts on my phone. And certainly, you know, we're not, I think that is one misconception about us. We don't.
[00:25:09] Heather: We don't legislate anything. We don't, um, we are not the mayor's office. We are not, you know, the chief of police. We're not, but we are certainly, um, tuned into all of those people. And there were, they're very much, you know, we're partners hand in hand with all of those different, um, entities. So that was a, certainly a police, you know, um, it was for them to, to take care of, but we, um, yeah.
[00:25:34] Heather: You know, we just tried to support as best we could. Um, I remember the next morning taking donuts down to all the media that was in town from all over the U S but that's, that's what we do in Nashville. We take care of people and whether that's the media, whether that's the police, um, whoever it is, you know, in those moments, that's where we want to just support as best we can.
[00:25:57] Heather: Um, I mean, we're really fortunate that, [00:26:00] More that people weren't hurt. Um, but it's been really hard for second Avenue. I would encourage people to get down to second Avenue. There are businesses there that need our support. And, um, and there's a lot of good stuff going on down there. Um, Luke Combs place just opened up, which is really a lot of fun too.
[00:26:16] Spencer: Yeah, that's, it's really fascinating to look back at the history of Nashville. As it relates to tourism and see these significant moments, sometimes of tragedy, right, that like the flood we're talking about that. I think we could look back on that bombing and perhaps 5 10 years from now, you may be talking about that to say from that moment forward.
[00:26:42] Spencer: This is how it reshaped it. Second Avenue. Correct. And change the trajectory of a part of downtown because who knows what's gonna come out of that. And I think that's just so what I love about Tennessee. I mean, we've seen it with all of the flooding that is happening right now. That's right. That [00:27:00] is recovering from the flooding that right now in east and northeast Tennessee.
[00:27:04] Spencer: And I think that will be a moment where we plant a flag in the ground and say, this is the moment that things changed. Yes. to see your role, you get to be a big part of telling that story. Mm hmm. And I think that's so fun that, uh, you get to tell a story of more than just downtown Nashville, you get to tell a story and that's a hard story to tell.
[00:27:28] Heather (4): It is hard.
[00:27:29] Spencer: And it's, it's like, how do we know that, you know, Nashville does this, but it's this, and it's this, and it's just, you kind of have to. It's a complex city.
[00:27:38] Heather: I say that to people all the time. You know, country music laid this amazing foundation for all of the creativity you find here. Without those I truly believe without country music, without the industry that that brought here, the songwriters, the producers, the musicians, that laid the [00:28:00] foundation for, first of all, all the other genres of music to happen, but also just the creative spirit and the sense of community.
[00:28:07] Heather: When you think about songwriters who collaborate and They will tell you, go to LA and write a song, and it's, well, you wrote 20%, but I wrote 40. That doesn't happen here. And I really think that pervades the business community and, you know, the culinary scene. We have chefs that collaborate all the time and share ideas, and that doesn't happen everywhere you go.
[00:28:31] Heather: And that's really, really special. And I think we're, we're fortunate to live in a city like that. But I do think country music. gives people a connotation about the city. Um, that number one, I hear a lot of people say, well, I don't like country music. And I go, well, it's a lot broader than you probably understand.
[00:28:52] Heather: Um, and number two, I think they think that's all that's here. And so it, It is a much more [00:29:00] complex city than, you know, I would say country music is our front door. Once you get through that front door, you start to go, Oh, now I really get it. There's a 14 time Grammy award winning symphony orchestra.
[00:29:13] Heather: There's an award winning, uh, Culinary scene. There are chefs, designers, fashion designers, makers, entrepreneurs doing all kinds of things. I mean people are shocked when I say healthcare is our number one industry. Far and away our number one industry. I was
[00:29:29] Carli: gonna say that. It's people are shocked. It's probably not as It's a little sexy to sell on a billboard, but I mean, we are the most innovative in health care.
[00:29:36] Carli: That's it.
[00:29:36] Heather: And people, um, are very surprised to find that out. They don't understand the depth of, of the city necessarily. Well, and how many universities?
[00:29:45] Carli: Are in Davidson County alone,
[00:29:48] Heather: it's like 12. It's
[00:29:49] Carli: staggering.
[00:29:50] Heather: It's a crazy number.
[00:29:51] Carli: It's a great place to get an education regardless of like your faith, creed, background.
[00:29:55] Carli: We've got something for everyone in terms of education. Absolutely. [00:30:00] Okay. I have a dodgy question and I just don't know who else I can ask this question to. Um, so whenever we go downtown and what the different neighborhoods, whether it be the Gulch or whatever, There are always the scooters and there are always drunk half dressed girls on scooters And i've just been a mom long enough to be like, oh sweet girl I just feel like you're gonna fall.
[00:30:21] Carli: I feel like you might die and so Can you like speak a little bit about the culture around those scooters and what you've had to deal with with that?
[00:30:28] Heather: Well pre covid um, that was certainly We were able to get that regulated so that there were, you know, certain companies, certain, it was sort of a free for all, right?
[00:30:40] Heather: And from a safety standpoint, it needed to be regulated. So you know, every city deals with it. It's everywhere you go now. It is, right? It's in all major cities. It's on college campuses. It's in small towns now. I mean, my kids go to a school, a small school in Ohio, a small town, um, and, um, it's They're there.
[00:30:58] Heather: You know, it, it, I think it's a [00:31:00] little bit of a way of life now, but yes, certainly we always are concerned about. I mean, that is our number one concern, right? Bottom line, if people don't feel safe, they're not going to come to your city. So, safety is always important. Top of mind for us and scooters are a piece of what we hope stay safe.
[00:31:19] Heather: Um, yeah
[00:31:20] Carli: mom to mom I'm gonna be like, here's a helmet. I know
[00:31:23] Heather: you can do this leave me I know my kids my kids have ridden scooters on their college campus and um, it makes me nervous wreck So I know it might just be
[00:31:32] Carli: me.
[00:31:32] Heather: Okay, I've got
[00:31:33] Carli: one more Uh, the pedal tavern bus party bus culture. My kids love it.
[00:31:42] Carli: Yeah. We go to a Titans game and they're blaring, you know, Britney Spears and Miley and they're waving and dancing and all the Bachelorettes think they're the cutest things. And so my kids love it. I wonder how do all the businesses feel about that? How have you guys worked to regulate? Because there are so many companies now.
[00:31:57] Carli: I mean, I think I saw last time we were down there. Yeah. Okay. Wasn't [00:32:00] there like a tank or something pulled by tractors?
[00:32:02] Spencer: Hot tubs. I mean, there, there's some stuff down there.
[00:32:05] Heather: Well, we have worked with, uh, to try to, you know, from a safety standpoint, again, you know, there was a time when people could just stand up and there was no, there was no regulation to have seats.
[00:32:18] Heather: There was no, that's just not safe, you know? So that's, that's been our take on it. Um, it needs to be safe and it needs to not, uh, impede. Rush hour traffic and and all of those things. So people certainly come and have a great time and we want them to come and have a great time, but safety again and um, you know, quality of life for for locals needs to be a piece of that too.
[00:32:44] Heather: We've rerouted them a couple of times different, you know, when certain things are happening. They have to take a different route. So the city, um, has certainly worked on that, um, as has the, at the state level, they've worked on that as well.
[00:32:56] Carli: It's super entrepreneurial. Like, love them. Totally. Hate them.[00:33:00]
[00:33:00] Carli: Everything in between. And it's fun. People have fun. You know, nobody's like, you know what I can do. And those are everywhere too, by the way. Because I can
[00:33:07] Heather: get a tractor. It's cool. They're in Dublin, Ireland. They're in, I mean, those are also, you know, I've never been able to ask anyone, and
[00:33:15] Carli: over the last five years I've seen such growth.
[00:33:17] Carli: Well
[00:33:17] Heather: again, we don't regulate those things, right? Those are regulated at the city and state level. But We certainly understand the need for it to not impede traffic, um, and like anything, right, it's a balancing act, um, of, of making sure, um, people are safe and, and people can have fun too. They're
[00:33:38] Carli: having a good time.
[00:33:39] Heather: They're having a good time. They're
[00:33:40] Heather (4): having a good
[00:33:41] Spencer: time. They're having a good time. They're having a good time. Alright, so, Heather, if you leave out of here and you get a phone call where they say, alright, Nashville, you We don't need any more on the map. We don't need Heather anymore. You've got to go to a different city to mark.
[00:33:54] Spencer: Okay. So you're forced to have to go somewhere else. I know that my [00:34:00] answer would probably be Phoenix, Arizona, right? I could market the heck out of salsa, guacamole, and taco. You give me those three things, I give you an unlimited amount of visitors because I could eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner off of a taco.
[00:34:14] Spencer: So, uh, if you had to go and be in another city, uh, maybe it's something that Uh, that city has that Nashville just doesn't have yet or some feature that would be fun for you to get to market that you just haven't gotten to do that here. Uh, where would you go if
[00:34:34] Heather: not in Nashville? I don't know. Honestly, I don't know the answer because quite frankly, we are so lucky.
[00:34:40] Heather: Yeah, yeah. Our brand, I mean, Cities would kill for the brand of music city. they would kill So I'm not sure I'd really go anywhere else. It would have to be, um, you know, I love an underdog. Okay. I mean, I, Nashville was an underdog when I started. Um, I remember I came up through PR into [00:35:00] marketing and, um, I remember back in the day, journalists had no desire, I would go to New York and meet with journalists, and they would say, Oh, yeah, I don't really like country music.
[00:35:12] Heather: I don't think I need to come to Nashville. And I knew if I could just get them to the city, I didn't have to do anything. The people of Nashville, the businesses, the, you know, the experience would speak for itself. Um, So Nashville wasn't, we're not an underdog anymore, but we were for a long time. So I love, I love an underdog city.
[00:35:30] Heather: I'm trying to think of, or state even quite frankly, um, or a place that has some misconceptions, maybe. Um, I always think about the state of New Jersey being, um, under appreciated, I think. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah.
[00:35:43] Spencer: Kind of living in the shadow.
[00:35:45] Heather: Um, I think there's a lot of really interesting things that happen in that state that people don't.
[00:35:50] Heather: appreciate because they're so overshadowed. Um, so it'd probably be somewhere like that, somewhere that people have a misconception or.
[00:35:57] Spencer: And it could be fun. Like, you know, we don't have [00:36:00] an ocean here, so that could be an element of being like, okay, you know, maybe finding something where there's some water or some different things.
[00:36:06] Spencer: Now that'd be relaxing. Mountains would
[00:36:08] Heather: be relaxing too. I don't know how, you know, different challenges, I guess. But yeah.
[00:36:13] Carli: When you talk about meeting with journalists and traveling all over to bring them here, How much has that changed over your 20 years? Did you start more with print media per se, you know, like women's magazines or travel and leisure?
[00:36:24] Carli: Now, how much of it is, are you trying to meet with influencers and content creators? Influencers.
[00:36:30] Heather: Honestly, we, um, I mean, we certainly work with them in terms of helping them curate whatever it is they need and setting them up with our partners. Um, but we don't pay influencers. Um, like a lot of cities do.
[00:36:43] Heather: We're real, again, um, We're really fortunate. Every celebrity that lives here is a big time
[00:36:47] Heather (3): influencer.
[00:36:49] Heather: We have a lot of influencers who live here. There are a lot of major big influencers that have a big following who live here. So we're really fortunate that way. [00:37:00] And a lot of them are great about, you know, If we have a, a program running about saying, I just love this, I just, I'm happy to help kind of deal.
[00:37:12] Heather: So um, we, we certainly help influencers. There are, you know, we try to find partners that are looking for that help from influencers and set them up that way versus us paying influencers. We still work with traditional media all the time, all the time. Um, you know, we love a good freelance journalist who has their own following and writes for multiple publications and, um, can maybe help us get a few different stories in a few different ways.
[00:37:40] Heather: Um, you know, some influencers are on television, so that is sort of a, a way to look at it too. Um, I still consider them sort of media, traditional media in the sense that they're on a, on TV, but.
[00:37:53] Carli: If you had a magic wand, what would you do? And there was a part of downtown that you could add, like, as you travel and [00:38:00] you've been in this industry, I mean, like you said, we have a symphony, we have a great, well, we have a football team, we have a hockey team, we have baseball now and soccer, um, but is there anything that like, Has a sparkle to it that you're like gosh I wish we could bring this or that maybe you can say you are trying to bring this to the city Yeah,
[00:38:22] Heather: it would be great to have a big family attraction.
[00:38:26] Heather: I think that would be really
[00:38:28] Carli: like
[00:38:28] Heather: what would be an
[00:38:29] Carli: example?
[00:38:30] Heather: Um, I don't know, you know, we used to have Opryland theme park. Mm hmm. So I'm not saying it's a theme park, but some sort of You know, we have the zoo, and we have Adventure Science Center, and we have, um, but it would be great to have a big anchor, like a, maybe it is a theme park, I don't know.
[00:38:45] Heather: Yeah. Um, but, um, some, something for, more for families would be great. That would be great for locals as well. Um, and I, I would love to see, and I think it, we will see this as, um, The East Bank comes alive, the riverfront being more [00:39:00] activated would be really, really nice. Um, and I think that, that will happen eventually for sure.
[00:39:06] Carli: Love that.
[00:39:07] Spencer: How do you think about transit and, the role that that plays in downtown because you look at a place like New Orleans where it's just part of the feel that they've got the, the, the, I don't know what you call it. It's not sidecars, Charlie cars. Yeah. Charlie car is coming down the middle and it's part of the stick there.
[00:39:30] Spencer: Um, Nashville for a long time has been said, Hey, It's tough to get around from a transit perspective, but, you know, it's like subway doesn't feel right for, for Nashville. I mean, there's just, you know, there, there's, there's some trains, but it's unclear that those are really getting used very much. So how do you feel like transit fits into the discussion?
[00:39:53] Heather: I think it's really important for a lot of reasons. One being, international travelers are [00:40:00] used to transit. Um, they have it all over Europe, for example, you know, it's, it's, it's just the way of life there trains. And, um, but then also for our workforce,
[00:40:11] Heather (3): you know,
[00:40:12] Heather: it's really important that we have a bus system that our workforce can use in the hospitality industry.
[00:40:18] Heather: So it's, it's an important piece where. You know, excited for all that's coming with, um, the new transit plan. Um, but yeah, it's a concern for, um, for any business, quite honestly, these days. I think it's, it's a concern, um, and something that's important. You know, we, it would be great to get, and I, I, I think this will happen eventually as well, um, Something that takes people directly from the airport to downtown.
[00:40:43] Heather: Boy, wouldn't that be nice. Would be great for visitors to have. I don't even know what that
[00:40:47] Heather (3): would
[00:40:47] Heather: look like. Yeah. Um, you know, whether it's a bus or, um, whatever it may be. Dedicated bus lane, whatever. Anything. It would be great to have, you know, there are some, um, some [00:41:00] shuttles that are coming that will run, which will be really helpful.
[00:41:03] Heather: But the easier we can make that, um, for visitors, the better. Both on the convention side, international, all of it really.
[00:41:11] Spencer: Yeah. Um, I want to make sure, I know you've brought some fun stats, just if there's any that you feel like would, would read into the record of saying, just to teach people, I think if there's just a highlight or two, I want to make sure that you get the chance to share.
[00:41:25] Heather: Well, you shared one of them, the 29. 5 million a day. I think people don't realize the spend that's happening.
[00:41:33] Heather: And,
[00:41:34] Heather: um,
[00:41:34] Heather: and that doesn't, that's not. It's not like that's all coming back to us, you know, that is going into business owners pockets and paying wages and Going into you know, the tax collections There's the state and and the local taxes that that that is going to as well and we employ 73,000 people In the hospitality industry, that's a lot of jobs, a lot of jobs.
[00:41:57] Heather: It's,
[00:41:58] Heather: um,
[00:41:58] Heather: the second [00:42:00] biggest industry in terms of,
[00:42:01] Heather: um,
[00:42:01] Heather: employment,
[00:42:02] Heather: um,
[00:42:02] Heather: to health, to health care. And you know, it's a little bit like the music industry now. It didn't used to be this way, but I think with the growth of tourism, you know, in Nashville, it's always like, oh, you know, somebody in the music industry in some form or fashion.
[00:42:16] Heather: And if you stop and think about it, you usually know somebody in the hospitality industry too. So it's become a piece of our fabric and important to our economy.
[00:42:26] Heather: Did I
[00:42:26] Carli: read in prep for this? Is it true that was it 3,000 dollars per household or resident in Davidson County over 3,000 dollars they would have to pay if we didn't have this level of tourism.
[00:42:37] Carli: Yes.
[00:42:38] Heather: Every household would pay, I think it's like thirty three dollars or thirty two hundred dollars More in taxes. More in taxes if tourism wasn't adding that to the funds. Yes. Every household. So, you know, and, and beyond that. I think we've added to the quality of, of life here when you think about,
[00:42:58] Heather: um,
[00:42:58] Heather: the restaurant scene, [00:43:00] those restaurants could not stay open on locals alone.
[00:43:03] Heather: They have to have visitors in those restaurants. So hopefully those kinds of things, the museums that we're so fortunate to have, whether that's the Country Music Hall of Fame or the Frist Art Museum, they can't live on locals alone. We have to have visitors to keep those places open and, and I think our residents benefit from that.
[00:43:22] Spencer: Yeah. Maybe as we wrap up, Heather, for someone that maybe is hearing this and is discovering for themselves that this is a career opportunity. Oh, look, Heather's doing what I would love to do, which is to brag about my city. Talk just a little bit about what your team looks like. So like, if somebody wanted to say, I want to do what Heather does, and they're not coming for your job, but like, I want to do what Heather does, Talk to me about She's moving
[00:43:47] Carli: to the beach, so somebody's coming for, uh, Heather's job, right?
[00:43:52] Spencer: Uh, how should they get involved? Is there room for them to, to go? Like, how would Sure, there's all
[00:43:57] Heather: kinds of ways. We actually have on our website, [00:44:00] um, there's a website called Hospitality Works, and that is where, um, Um, so you'll see all kinds of job openings on, on that, uh, website, but it is good for people to understand people automatically think hotels and they think, you know, certain jobs within hotels, but Maybe they don't think about the finance jobs in hotels or the marketing jobs in hotels or You know on our team.
[00:44:29] Heather: We have a creative team So people designing our website and our collateral and all of those kinds of things so that it is a much broader industry I think than when people sort of first think hospitality and There's, you know, PR agencies that do PR for restaurants. There are marketing agencies that are working with our attractions.
[00:44:52] Heather: So it is, it's a, it's a broad field.
[00:44:55] Spencer: That's good. Well, Heather, we do one thing to wrap up each podcast where, [00:45:00] um, I read a short sentence with a blank at the end. You haven't seen this ahead of time. So the way this works, uh, is I'll read the sentence and give the blank. If you'll just repeat the sentence back to me, and then you can fill in whatever you think would fit in that blank.
[00:45:13] Spencer: Okay, I'll give it a shot. We'll see. You're going to do great at it. Okay? Ready? If I could describe Nashville in three words, they would be
[00:45:24] Heather: blank. If I could describe Nashville in three words, they would be authentic, creative, and friendly.
[00:45:32] Spencer: Got that right away. That was good. Okay. I hope so.
[00:45:35] Heather: That's one I better get right.
[00:45:36] Heather: I was going to say, yeah, she should know those,
[00:45:39] Carli: yeah. That's great.
[00:45:40] Spencer: The best kept secret in Nashville for visitors is blank.
[00:45:46] Carli: We already know she doesn't keep secrets. I know. So it's not going to be a place. For
[00:45:49] Heather: visitors. The The best kept secret in Nashville for visitors is our unique neighborhoods.
[00:45:57] Spencer: Yeah. And the last one.[00:46:00]
[00:46:00] Spencer: If I could change one thing about Nashville's tourism scene, it would be blank.
[00:46:07] Heather: Hmm. That's a hard one. Let's see. Blank. If I could change one thing about Nashville's tourism scene, it would be that visitors would Explore more of those neighborhoods. Yeah, and understand and support those local businesses
[00:46:34] Carli: Maybe start on lower broad.
[00:46:36] Carli: That's right. And just everybody's right a scooter out
[00:46:38] Heather: Look, right. There is no right scooter to East Nashville. Yeah, there is nothing like lower Broadway in the world People other cities would give their right arm to have a lower Broadway and it is so much fun It is one of those things sort of like to me the Grand Ole Opry everyone should do yeah in their lifetime and It is a [00:47:00] blast and it's a lot of fun, but Nashville is a diverse and eclectic and creative place and there's a lot to explore.
[00:47:06] Spencer: And it's fun to speak earlier to the international component of Nashville's tourism. The airport is creating a new extended runway to allow flights to come from Asia. Eventually that
[00:47:18] Heather: will happen, yes. And
[00:47:20] Spencer: that is going to be We hope
[00:47:21] Heather: that's
[00:47:22] Spencer: down the road. Yeah, that'll be an interesting component too that'll bring a whole different aspect.
[00:47:26] Spencer: That's right. To Nashville's tourism. So, uh, Heather, it's been a real treat to have you here. It's been fun for someone who's responsible for telling the story of Nashville and all of its depth to it, all of its complexity. You do a great job of doing that. And I really just love the perspective that you've been here for so long too, that you have enough history to say.
[00:47:50] Spencer: I know what it was like during these pivotal moments of the city And it really makes me proud to know that you're uh helping secure nashville in the [00:48:00] future
[00:48:00] Heather: Well, we're fortunate we have a lot of Long time employees in our office who have been through a lot of the exact things we talked about and, and longevity matters.
[00:48:11] Heather: Understanding what worked and what didn't work in a moment like a flood and having that to draw on is really important.
[00:48:18] Spencer: Yeah, because there's a lot of people that we don't want to lose the culture of Nashville. And that's so critical. And I just really appreciate the fact that you have so much to draw on because you were here before.
[00:48:29] Spencer: It's cool. Yeah. And that's neat.
[00:48:31] Heather: And that was a fun time too.
[00:48:34] Spencer: Thank you for the time. Thank you. I
[00:48:35] Heather: appreciate it. Thank you for having me.
[00:48:43] Spencer: Heather Middleton of Visit Music City. She has an interesting job and I really like her story of how she kind of just stumbled into the role and intersection of a lot of passions that she's had over her life and [00:49:00] she's stuck with it and She's a big part of what people are to understand about Nashville, and that's an important seat for her as someone that is trying to do the right thing by the city, but also make sure that we don't turn the cities into something.
[00:49:18] Spencer: We don't want to have it be. And so she does a good job of right out of the gate saying, um, There's more to Nashville than Broadway.
[00:49:29] Carli: And it's uniquely challenging because as she said, too, she doesn't legislate. Yeah. You know, she's not in charge of what businesses get to come or where they're zoned or the transportation conversations, or I liked teasing about the scooters and the party buses, but they don't make those decisions, but they are part of Making sure the culture stays correct and that people know about what exists and broadening their horizons.
[00:49:55] Carli: And I think she did a really good job of how she navigated our questions [00:50:00] about some of that because I would bet that is much, much harder to walk her role of she is the marketing arm. I'm sure there are many things she would love to change. She won't say what she would love to change because She can't change it in what she's doing and being really positive and an advocate for the city Regardless of what's going on.
[00:50:22] Carli: And I think she handled that with great class.
[00:50:25] Spencer: Yeah, it's tough because Undoubtedly, she fields endless complaints about things that she has no control over. Sure, which is essentially what you're saying It's like she has so much to work with, but much of what she does and does not have to work with is outside of her control.
[00:50:45] Spencer: And I think that spirit came through and she likes going with an underdog. She's taken Nashville from a place that was not a destination spot for many people. And [00:51:00] I also really appreciated how you could see her whole demeanor change when she talked about the flood in 2010. I mean, we didn't ask her this, but I felt like if she had to identify one singular moment that has changed the trajectory of her life, Nashville, across her whole career, it probably was the flood.
[00:51:21] Spencer: It certainly, she said, was the start of tourism. And she could trace the data back to that moment. There's something to study there. We got to spend a little bit of time with that, but there's something more to unpack about what was it about the flood That coming out the other side, people said, I want to start going to Nashville.
[00:51:44] Spencer: I mean, if anything, you'd think maybe I wouldn't, I'll do less of that, but instead it was the opposite. So there was something that happened. I don't know if it was the national attention that Nashville got as a result of the damage. from the flood, or if it was how much the [00:52:00] country music stars rallied around.
[00:52:02] Spencer: Like you and I went to, you know, concerts and events and yeah. And, and maybe it just brought it to the attention to people that hadn't had an occasion to go to Nashville in a while to say, you know what, there's something more there than what I last remembered.
[00:52:18] Carli: You know, I think that's interesting. I think if you looked at the data across natural disasters or major events that change a city.
[00:52:26] Carli: You know, in our lifetime, Katrina was one of those, Hurricane Katrina was one of those things. Yeah. Even you and I found ourselves going to an away Titans game to try to support New Orleans. That's true. And everyone, and I remember walking the streets of New Orleans when we were there, and there were people that clearly didn't have a home, or clearly just passing their time sitting on the sidewalk, and they looked at us and said, Thank you so much for coming to our city.
[00:52:52] Heather (4): Yeah.
[00:52:53] Carli: And I do think that spirit, similar to what we experienced in New Orleans, existed in Nashville after the flood. [00:53:00] And I think you would never ask for those situations, right? You would never say, you know what I want to have happen this year. Let's put that on my bingo card, right? Tornadoes or floods or unrest.
[00:53:13] Carli: And, but I really do think they stress the fabric of it. of a society and of a community and the ones that make it out with that new trajectory, I think it shows their heartbeat. And that's what you and I are really trying to get at even on this podcast is what makes Tennessee special. And that's one idea of Nashville and Davidson County and what has made that special.
[00:53:34] Carli: But I would guarantee Whether it be from Hurricane Helen in eastern Tennessee, northeastern Tennessee, there are things across our state that have made Tennesseans uniquely the volunteer state, taking care of each other. And when she said creative and kind, that is what I see from everybody. And I think that Tennessee is just uniquely gritty.
[00:53:59] Carli: I kind of [00:54:00] think of us there's a lot of data coming out about only children right now and how only children tend to be more successful than their siblings because they have to manage up and they have to manage down and they're kind of squished and Darn it. If tennessee is not the middle child of the country.
[00:54:15] Carli: We're kind of squished in the middle We're south but we're not as south as mississippi or florida or alabama. We're not certainly not midwest or northern We're right smack dab In the middle and I think We get really unique people and really unique pressure from all of the communities around our state that has just made us well rounded Roll with the punches and I think it's part of why we're being so successful
